[Compcomm] Let's Get Things Started

[Danny Baumann]

Hi,

> > Hmm... I thought that compiz was going to be the core, while
> > compiz-extra would be all else. And would be "renamed" so that compiz,
> > nor beryl remained, as to make it so neither project swallows the
> > other?
> This is and has been the idea of some people that came out of nowhere
> and wanted to re-join the compiz-community (but of course only if compiz
> satisfies their requests).

Ah, yes, so Jeff is one of those people?
http://forum.compiz.org/viewtopic.php?t=677

I believe he isn't.

> There was no idea of merging or re-joining among the compiz-comunity up
> to that point. We designed our idea of comiz-extra to make life easier
> for everyone, not to make ourselves the new celebrities or to reach the
> stars with our incredible new DE (which doesn't even contain a useable
> settings-manager right now).

Hmm, is there anyone who wants to be 'a new celebrity'? I believe there
is noone.

> When the idea of a "merge" was brought up (I don't know who brought up
> that term - I hate it), at least 75% of the compiz-community were
> _against_ fulfilling a single requirement of that "merge on"-thing. 

Can you please point me to that 75% of the Compiz community raising
their opinion? I only saw statements by a handful of people. Thanks.

> Remember - we (the compiz-users) are "refugees" ... we were robbed
> everything we had. People took away what we liked and worked on, renamed
> it to something they prefered and left us with nothing in hand. We were
> screamed at and some of us were insulted and told to shut up ... We
> rebuilt everything we have today with our own energy and passion.

I feel like having a deja-vu. We really heard that stuff around 1
million times already, and honestly I don't think discussing on an
emotional level is productive at all as there are no objective facts
when discussing emotional.

> So - is it soooo difficult to understand that we feel the way we do???
> We are not acting as a bunch of 3 or 4 people here, we are acting in
> sense of hundreds of members of our community ... Mike even more than
> anyone else around here.

I don't really think Mike acts on behalf of the Compiz community, heck,
he doesn't even act in sense of the majority of the Compiz Managing
Commitee. Statements like:

"I said before, I dont want to host my work under a 'project' and I
do not want people to claim my work as being 'Gem' or whatever
else.  I want them to be compiz plugins, thats all."

don't really sound like being said by the biggest team player. :-/

> If David wouldn't have talked about the _possibility_ of fulfilling the
> needs of a wider user-base by creating a more feature-rich package out
> of what Jeff described as "compiz-extra", you would NEVER have any valid
> argument for getting through all this "merge" ...

So you say "If there was no Compiz-Extra, no merge would be needed?
That's right, indeed.

> > I wasn't calling anyone a flamer, nor was I speaking on behalf of
> > beryl. I'm was simply stating, if anyone disliked what I wrote, and
> > had the need to flame me for it, simply contact me so we can keep it
> > out of this mailing list.
> > 
> I think Mike's point is that some people always start crying "help,
> flamwewar!!!" whenever they see that their arguments are weak and
> unrealistic (or someone else just tells the truth). That produced the
> totally untrue vision that we (as compiz-admins) always attack the poor
> little beryl-project ... all those friendly guys who only want to create
> the next generation desktop exeperience.
> 
> It is quite understandable that he (and me, too) gets mad at this.

It is not acceptable to me (and others, too) that he doesn't stop
attacking even after Beryl stops existing, sometimes with untrue
arguments presented as facts. Can you (or Mike) explain the reasonings
behind that to me? 
We really do not need comments like "You guys were told many times that
the fork was not necessary and would lead to this." Noone of us has a
time machine, so comments like that are completely unconstructive.

Regards,

Danny

BTW: No objections against you being in a WEB team if such a team will
exist ;-)